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Author Topic: Name-Changing Rule?  (Read 488 times)

Hank

  • Topic Author
Name-Changing Rule?
«: August 22, 2014, 07:42:33 PM»
I took notice of the two postings on the home page recently after rejoining this website and was reminded of a thread I read a while back. Essentially, the thread had been created with regards to a user annoyed that people were deleting their accounts and making new ones. In the thread (I think) Narnia said something to the effect that he wasn't going to force somebody to keep their account/ID.

My question is: Are players allowed to delete their accounts and make new ones? And if so, doesn't this kind of contradict the point of the name-changing rule since a name change is a less drastic alternative?

I understand that it causes confusion, but I highly doubt that's the real intent of the person. People often wind up harassed or in some sort of situation that a change of identity through internet handle seems like a viable option. It would seem to me that a user's privacy should outweigh the potential confusion a name-change could cause. Making it more difficult for a user to change an identity is only more likely to cause 'witch hunts'.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2014, 07:45:07 PM by Hank »


Offline Monobear

Re: Name-Changing Rule?
«Reply #1: August 22, 2014, 08:08:50 PM»
I'm going to post here because this post was highly pointed at me. No I mean not the post you wrote but rather the new rule change. That's alright they changed the rule to me. The rule was made because Gaga warned me not to change my name. I did it after their first warning but in my defense:

Sometimes people are indecisive or want to change their name to match their new alt.
In my case I am extremely indecisive! I'd always think of something better and 5 minutes later change it. Since they are not looking at time stamps of when I changed it and they most likely only see: You changed your name 10 times this week. We are going to give you a warning. That's fair to think that way. I can understand and agree it may confuse people to. ( Say you have the name BOB but decide you want Fred so you change it, then two seconds later you decide Franky is a better name. Add it there. That tally ups your count to 2 times even if people never seen you had it as Fred. If you get what i mean with that. ) So you should probably pick a name you can really keep. Or rather think it over before just jumping in and changing it. Like I did.

Everyone sometimes gets indecisive and wants the ability to change it if they think of something better. Even if it was 5 minutes later. It's a nice feature and I can understand you questioning their actions.

However they are staff and most likely talked this over with Narnia before making the rule. So questioning why the rule changed may not be the best course of action.

While I can't speak for them.. I can say it's probably best not to worry about it and just follow the rules. As I should have done so..Well so I didn't have to lose the ability to change it completely. You can change your name but they are just saying don't do it weekly, or be indecisive about it. Stick to it more than 6 months, maybe even a year, longer?. ;__;
« Last Edit: August 22, 2014, 08:17:26 PM by Monobear »

Contact in game: Monobear

Offline Zim

Re: Name-Changing Rule?
«Reply #2: August 22, 2014, 09:01:46 PM»
My question is: Are players allowed to delete their accounts and make new ones? And if so, doesn't this kind of contradict the point of the name-changing rule since a name change is a less drastic alternative?

I understand that it causes confusion, but I highly doubt that's the real intent of the person. People often wind up harassed or in some sort of situation that a change of identity through internet handle seems like a viable option. It would seem to me that a user's privacy should outweigh the potential confusion a name-change could cause. Making it more difficult for a user to change an identity is only more likely to cause 'witch hunts'.

You absolutely may not create a new account. Users have always been allowed only one account (except the brief time we had DNB accounts, before the private option on alt lists).

The rule isn't meant to stop people from changing their names, only changing it excessively. As I said in the announcement, people are still absolutely allowed to change their names. The issue comes from people who change it several times a month. (And no Monobear, you are not the only person that we've spoken to about it)

I don't know what you mean by "causing witch hunts." Most of the time when people are genuinely trying to hide for something they did, they create new accounts. Staff can still see who you were previously (your profile shows names changes to staff, which is how we know when people are abusing the system). There are plenty of other ways to your privacy rather than constant name changes (which isn't even a privacy issue, since your posts stay the same??).

Confusion will happen whether it's the user's intention or not. The intent and the result are not the same thing, by any stretch of the imagination.

I'm only mean out of necessity.

Hank

  • Topic Author
Re: Name-Changing Rule?
«Reply #3: August 23, 2014, 07:03:28 PM»
I realized you can only have one account, but I meant when people have 1 account, delete it, and then a week or two later decide to re-open a new account under a new identity. I can't seem to find the thread at the moment, but I believe it was under suggestions. It may have disappeared.

As for witch hunting, I was referring to the common occurrence where people unfortunately choose to step into a situation (usually with good intention) and head in the complete wrong direction. If a person checks Trading Scams, sees that the alt "Zim" was involved in a scam for instance, they would see "Oh this user owned Zim at one point, lets see what other alts they're on". Generally, if you delete an account and make a new one, they only wind up going after alts the deleted account has mentioned owning in the past since that's what shows up when they search for that user's threads. However, if you're bound to one identity, not only would people wind up bothering all those past alts, but they would try contacting every new alt that person has posted about since. Which is why I think it potentially increases harassment to users.

I do definitely see how legitimate scammers would use it to their advantage, since they are trying to escape paying their dues. But a lot of the time mob mentality kicks in with some users and they go on a 'witch hunt' for something that could potentially just have been a simple mishap between two parties. It can potentially ruin a person's credibility. If I bought the alt 'Zim' recently, and an account with a long list of past alt ownership does get into some trouble after previously owning Zim, the person who buys that alt gets roped into it. Later on, even if the situation is resolved, the person who now owns 'Zim' might get negatively looked upon because a user remembered hearing about a scam topic involving them.

Creating a longer history attached to IDs only seems more likely to cause problems. Which is why I'm wondering if creating a new ID by deleting your previous one is still allowed (assuming it isn't something ridiculous like several times a month).

[Sorry if this is a little bit confusing :P Trying to adequately voice my concern.]

 

Offline Zim

Re: Name-Changing Rule?
«Reply #4: August 23, 2014, 07:27:04 PM»
Deleting an account to make a new one has never really been allowed either. We'll do it, but only if you have a damn good reason, which we have yet to come across.

If people are being harassed on here, though, it's better to report it to the staff to take care of it than breaking the rules as well. Furcadia also has safeguards in place for harassment caused by "witch hunts."

In the same vein, people could (and have) scam people and then come back on a new account to pretend like it never happened, hence why we don't allow it. We've had more instances of people coming back after doing something like that than being falsely accused (which tends to get cleared up pretty quickly here, most of the time).

Frankly, it seems like you're disregarding most of what I'm saying for the sake of being upset about something. I outline most of this either in the announcement or the existing rules.

This is not a policy we are going to be changing anytime soon, so I'm not even sure where you're going with this. Staff have already discussed as many facets as we can on the situation and felt this was the best course of action, logically.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2014, 07:44:38 PM by Zim »

I'm only mean out of necessity.

Offline Cadaver

Re: Name-Changing Rule?
«Reply #5: August 23, 2014, 08:12:36 PM»
I'm going to reply to your last post, as it is the most recent.

Quote
I realized you can only have one account, but I meant when people have 1 account, delete it, and then a week or two later decide to re-open a new account under a new identity. I can't seem to find the thread at the moment, but I believe it was under suggestions. It may have disappeared.

As Zim has stated: We don't allow people to have more than one account, and if you want to delete one and create a new one, you had better have a very good reason for it.


Quote
As for witch hunting, I was referring to the common occurrence where people unfortunately choose to step into a situation (usually with good intention) and head in the complete wrong direction. If a person checks Trading Scams, sees that the alt "Zim" was involved in a scam for instance, they would see "Oh this user owned Zim at one point, lets see what other alts they're on". Generally, if you delete an account and make a new one, they only wind up going after alts the deleted account has mentioned owning in the past since that's what shows up when they search for that user's threads. However, if you're bound to one identity, not only would people wind up bothering all those past alts, but they would try contacting every new alt that person has posted about since. Which is why I think it potentially increases harassment to users.

If you are being harassed, simply report it to a moderator and we will handle it. Stuff like that is what we're here for.
Account hopping does nothing but a) break the rules (unless you've gotten prior staff approval, which is rare) and b) make you look suspicious.


Quote
I do definitely see how legitimate scammers would use it to their advantage, since they are trying to escape paying their dues. But a lot of the time mob mentality kicks in with some users and they go on a 'witch hunt' for something that could potentially just have been a simple mishap between two parties. It can potentially ruin a person's credibility. If I bought the alt 'Zim' recently, and an account with a long list of past alt ownership does get into some trouble after previously owning Zim, the person who buys that alt gets roped into it. Later on, even if the situation is resolved, the person who now owns 'Zim' might get negatively looked upon because a user remembered hearing about a scam topic involving them.

As we do not delete trading scam alerts on the site, if an alt is mentioned in one of those, it's going to keep that history. Avoiding the issue is as simple as pointing out that the alt has a new owner, and if someone presses the issue - report them for harassment.


Quote
Creating a longer history attached to IDs only seems more likely to cause problems. Which is why I'm wondering if creating a new ID by deleting your previous one is still allowed (assuming it isn't something ridiculous like several times a month).

This statement right here comes off as extremely suspicious to me. If you have done nothing wrong, why would you worry about the history on your altmarket account and want to make a new one?

Again, as has been stated: this rule is not about switching accounts, that's covered in the second rule of our forum. This rule is about changing the display name on your account excessively. We have no problems with people who change their names in moderation, but when it gets in excess of four to five times a month, it gets incredibly hard for buyers and sellers to keep track of the people they have bought and sold from.


Like Zim said, all of the staff agreed to this new rule and felt it the most logical, sensible option.
Cadaver
Baal || Cancer || Cruel || Jeremy
Sean || Virus || Zane

Alts For Sale || FAZ Account || DeviantART || Weasyl

Offline Monobear

Re: Name-Changing Rule?
«Reply #6: August 23, 2014, 08:15:27 PM»
Alright zim I understand I wasn't the only one ^^;.

I have one thing to add: or question for the staff. Years ago, i think it was 2007-2008,l I vaguely remember that users could delete there account. There was an option under our profiles that users could delete the account. Then with that said, we could could make a new one at a later date. Narnia has since changed the coding not allowing individuals to do that. Only staff have the option to remove accounts? I think it was because of the number of people doing it to get out of a scam, if I recall. It may be what Hank was referring to?


As we can see now, that function is no longer coded into the site at all.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2014, 08:23:11 PM by Monobear »

Contact in game: Monobear

Offline Zim

Re: Name-Changing Rule?
«Reply #7: August 23, 2014, 08:21:21 PM»
Yes, scammers were using it to delete their account and come back under new names to start the scamming process over again, which is why we had to stop allowing it.

I'm only mean out of necessity.

Offline Monobear

Re: Name-Changing Rule?
«Reply #8: August 23, 2014, 08:24:34 PM»
I thought so.  I think Hank may have been referring to that instance and more or so never knew the option was removed?

You can wait for his reply but it only makes sense to me.
I  can completely understand why Narnia changed the coding. It's 100% understandable.

Contact in game: Monobear

Offline RIKKI

Re: Name-Changing Rule?
«Reply #9: August 23, 2014, 10:09:23 PM»
Monobear, I'd like to point something out to you that is extremely incorrect in your first post. While your case was one of the more severe in regards to excessive changes, you were NOT the sole reason that prompted this rule's inception.

Like account deletions and even thread deletions before it, these were features that were abused to ridiculous degrees by users who eventually ended up scamming or in some sort of trouble with the userbase and staff. Once the issue happens enough times, we take the time to reflect and draft a rule in regards to the pressing issue.

A few rotten apples spoil the bunch. You are not a rotten apple, but your activity did contribute to this ongoing issue.

I don't like being called the root of the issue, and I don't think you should think so negatively of yourself because I was the one to deal with you personally. Would you assume it was Sean, Hayden or Zim's fault if they were the ones who dealt with you instead of me?


Offline Monobear

Re: Name-Changing Rule?
«Reply #10: August 23, 2014, 11:57:38 PM»
Well gaga I was just pointing out that I am defiantly at fault even if I am not not the whole fault. I think everyone makes mistakes but more importantly, sometimes it takes awhile to realize what stupid thing you did wrong. Pointing out my own flaws doesn't mean. i dislike any of the staff for doing there job or more importantly I don't dislike you or anything. I do appreciate you don't want me to think negatively of myself. I appreciate that but at the same time, I'm just the type of person to feel ashamed over my actions for awhile before moving on.

If I have worded something wrong or did something wrong in my writings I truly apologize. Hope everyone has a wonderful week. I will quit writing here now but thanks so much for everything. :) Have a dandy day Gaga and everyone else!

~Monobear.
« Last Edit: August 24, 2014, 12:00:16 AM by Monobear »

Contact in game: Monobear

Hank

  • Topic Author
Re: Name-Changing Rule?
«Reply #11: August 24, 2014, 08:30:07 PM»
My apologies if this came across as a complaint. Was merely asking if players were permitted to delete their accounts + create new ones since nothing was specifically specified with regards to that. I always interpreted the "1 account per person" rule to be "1 active account per person". The above user was correct. I wasn't aware that accounts required authorization to be deleted now. :P